Historical discussions of the ACN opportunity from Scam.com
Below you will find a fair use condensation of material from the scam.com forum. The views expressed are those of the original posters and not the editors or publishers of this site.
More detailed info can be found at ACN MLM networking business.
ACN Australian Communication Network versus Peter Bowditch.
ACN Scam.com discussions 2005
ACN Scam.com discussions 2006
ACN Scam.com discussions 2007-a
ACN Scam.com discussions 2007-b
ACN Scam.com discussions 2008
ACN Scam.com discussions 2008-b
ACN Scam.com discussions 2009
ACN Scam.com discussions 2009-c
Is ACN a Good Company?
04/09 - Simply put. ACN = not scam. Just another system of making money. LEGITIMATE!!! Registered in multiple countries and under multiple jurisdictions including (for those in the US) the FCC.
This is like having the IRS sleeping in your living room. I do not think that multiple governments around the world would allow a "scam" company to operate in their own country.
To back the company up, multiple former US Attorney Generals are involved with the company BEFORE major decisions are made. "Stop the problems before they begin"
ACN Horror Stories
Don't be a dream stealer.
This isn't a get rich quick deal. It's a get rich slow, which is better than get rich never. Do you know what JOB means? Just Over Broke. Two to three months away from bankruptcy if you lose your job. You are now a BUSINESS OWNER!
Just like any business you'll want to give it more than a year. If you follow the system properly, you'll make it. I have NEVER met anyone who has failed, just quitters and people who succeed. This isn't something you "try" this is something you COMMIT to.
Tip: STAY PLUGGED IN! Until you are making 6 figures a month, you'll need to be at as many trainings as possible! Make sure you sign up for Charlotte. I cannot tell you how important that is going to be. I promise you that it will put you 18-24 months ahead of others who do not go.
ACN Inc Scam
Once you stop recruiting, you stop making money. Even if you have a solid organization that is recruiting, you're still working a ton of hours by managing your downline. Instead of working a 9-5, you're working 24 hours a day, 7 days a week.
If you're a strong leader, you know what I'm talking about. You know that in order to make it, you have to constantly manage and motivate your downline. You get calls all the time, you're constantly at trainings and other get-togethers.
This business will consume you, whether you get rich or not. If you want to dedicate your life to a company, then go ahead, be my guest.
It's not walkaway income. The day you stop recruiting is the day you stop making money. That was my point.
You hit a point in your life when stopping people in the street and saying "Hey, do you ever look for ways to make extra money?", gets tired
ACN Leads Could Dry Up
04/09 - every day was just focusing on recruiting....most of the time I was helping new reps recruit. I couldn't go anywhere without thinking if someone was a potential rep or not.
If I was getting a burger at McDonald's, I'd size up the guy behind the counter and try to see if he would fit into my organization. I was a lot more selective, seeing as how I'd gotten past the "I'm desperate and I'll take anyone stage."
The problem was, most people in my downline weren't. I can't tell you how many would drop out or get discouraged because most of their reps were just not that interested.
I tried to teach them to be selective, but it's tough for someone be selective when they get a "yes" after 100 "no's".
Any MLM will tell you that the problem isn't with you, the problem is with everyone else...that they aren't working hard enough. That is a lie and it's a bad lie at that.
ACN Long Distance
I don't think there is any point in trying to convince these ACNers that skype is the more affordable and user friendly way to go.
I mean, these people are brainwashed to think that EVERY FAMILY on earth will have one of their videophones in the next 5 or 10 years. I cant stop laughing at that.
You keep laughing and we'll keep going to the bank and changing communications forever.
Comparing Skype to VideoPhone is outrageous. Not even the same platform. Like comparing VHS to DVD.
Skype also allows them to talk with millions of their peers without the need for proprietary technology. As shocking as it may be for some, old folks want to talk to people other than family.
Bottom line, they have a life to live, and a de facto Batphone to their kids is not likely a priority.
Is ACN History?
There is no growth/money in voice lines. If you want a stand alone voice line, you will probably use your cell phone.
There are only two viable options for most people for broadband. Either Cable, or DSL. And pretty much everyone will have one of the two unless they live in the boonies.
Once you have broadband, either cable, or DSL there is almost no cost to the provider to add video on top of that. AT&T does it with U-Verse, Verizon does it with FIOS, and cable already has it.
Dish/Direct tv will be paying a higher per consumer cost to go out, install a dish and maintain it, when AT&T, Verizon, and the local cable company will have the infrastructure in place.
Have you noticed that there are very few competitive long distance carriers/local carriers left? Why do you think they all went out of business?
There just isn't demand.
Now bundling video phones that cost over $100 with two year contracts - when people can get skype or many other programs for free is just another sign that they don't know where the market is going.
All evidence to the contrary as ACN has exploded. Our incomes have gone off the charts. It's amazing what is happening...shocking even.
I love all the chatter of how it cannot be done while the rest of us are doing it.
If someone doesn't want to join the business, that doesn't make them a "loser" or a person who "doesn't get it."
If someone joins the business and doesn't succeed, that doesn't make them "lazy".
ACN VOIP Review
01/09 - There is room at the top for everyone.Did you know that there is enough wealth in the world right now today for every single person on the planet to be a millionaire?
If we could all just come from a place of abundance instead of scarcity and realize that there is plenty enough for everyone, what a different world it would be.
Doesn't Believe ACN Platitudes
This is one of the biggest problems I have with MLMs - people talk out of their asses, and pass off these completely idiotic statements as fact and suddenly everyone else is running around parroting what turns out to be complete gibberish.
If they would only bring back the individual bonuses like they had in 2004. Back when they had those is when my ex's business was exploding.
Then when they took the TT bonus away and created the SC position, and then later took the bonuses away altogether, I think that's when things went downhill.
Who is ACN?
It's sort of like time shares, or other high pressure negotiations.... Do you have a phone? YES
Do you pay for it YES
Do you know other people who have phones YES
Would you like to make money off yours and your friends phones? YES
How would you like to be a millionare? YES
Sign right here and give me a check for $500!
What is ACN?
They are on the cutting edge of technology, and sell essential services..when will people stop using their phones, cell phones, watching TV, using the internet, etc?
I have to get a measly 20 services in the lifetime of my business..think all my other reps can do that to in 3-5 years? Why would any of my customers EVER leave me?
Seriously..my customers know me and want to help me..same model for everyone else in my business. When contracts expire, my customers will re-up with me. Same thing with my whole team.
ACN Marketing Group
RVPs Marcus Okopny and Nathan Goldberg and SVP Simon Abboud.
ACN Good or Bad?
How do you directly control how many people are in your 7th level - where the money is? (e.g. your recruit's recruit's recruit's recruit's recruit's recruit's)?
That is the power of ACN - its not what you do that counts - its the people far removed from you. Which is why so few people in ACN actually make much money - far from enough to live on.
This myth that they just need to try harder and they will make it.... is well a myth..... Lots of great people have failed at ACN through no fault of their own. They just didn't have the downline to support them.
But it does sound better to believe that you can control everything even if it is a myth.....
The business does work for 100% of the people that follow the system and give it the time and effort it deserves. I have not had a single person fail who gave it effort. NOT ONE!!!
The problem is that most people lack the mental fortitude to succeed. Their self-doubt, lack of mental toughness and conditioned thinking dooms them.
It's OK though...our only job is to sow good seed, become the best we can be and help those willing to change.
You can make excuses or money but not both.
Numbers Suggest an ACN Scam
Correct me if I am mistaken,
But if you sign up 6 people on your second level
and they each sign up 6 people on your third level
and they each sign up 6 people on your fourth level
and they each sign up 6 people on your fifth level
and they each sign up 6 people on your sixth level
You will have 7,776 people on your 6th level.....
The cool part is if those people get 6 people each you will have 46,656 people on your 7th level.
Just imagine, if those 7th level people try to get their own 7the leve beneath them!
That would be about 2.2 BILLION people if you managed to get to just 14 levels deep for one person.
Of course only three people could do that before almost the entire world was in ACN.
But thats the power of network marketting everyone can have thousands of people beneath them so they can make great money.... All it takes is dozens of groups of thousands of people that make little or nothing to support the few at the top....
ACN Fraud Timetable
Do you know how many times I heard that when I was in ACN? "The people who quit, quit too soon!!! It's always after you give up that you hit it big!!"
How on Earth would they have any way of knowing that? lol And then there are those testimonies: "Right after I was just about to give up, that's when I hit it big!!"
Info on ACN
05/09 - The difficulty of a task does not justify its existence. Nor does it make it particularly noble. You could try to drive a car with your feet, but that doesn't make it a good use of your time.
I have to add that because this business is a lot more difficult than they make it seem in business opportunity meetings... also, just because you might probably do well, doesn't mean the people underneath you will.
ACN's comp plan is still designed top-heavy, so those at the bottom aren't going to make very much. So you'd have to be okay with bringing a bunch of people into your business and knowing that even some of the ones who work their butts off are probably not going to make it.
That's one thing I have never been okay with... I personally like comp plans that are more balanced and let the people who aren't recruiting superstars make money too.
ACN Scam.com Forum Threads
So just because Skype offers lower prices in comparison to ACN, that doesn't mean ACN will fail or have a monstrous decrease in business. ACN will thrive b/c unlike SKype, ACN's video phone and other products allows:
- you to dial 911;
- it supports caller id;
- you dont have to be on your pc and signed in to place/receive calls
- you get 16+ features with the video phone
The features you cite for the phone can be had from a $10 phone from Sears or a cell phone almost everyone already has. Video is the only point of differentiation, and even that can be had for cheap.
Your hope is that people want convergence of their phone and webcam, will accept that they can only see folks with the same phone, and are willing to pay a lot for it.
It didn't work before, and nothing has changed in recent years that makes me think it will now.
If ACN's value proposition were as clear and straightforward as you say, their market share would be much bigger than it is. The market is teeming with fierce competition, all very capable of serving the customer.
ACN Phone Comparison
The features you mention are available on regular phones. Call waiting, call forwarding, caller ID, 3-way calling, etc... are available on much cheaper phones.
Voicemail via e-mail is actually cool and somewhat unique. Vonage has had that feature for some time though.
Also, as cool as it is, it can be replicated by your competitors with some ease given their immense resources. Furthermore, if someone can use a computer to listen to voicemails, they are capable of utilizing your cheap competitor.
I guess a computer is required after all. Video is another unique feature for a phone, but not for a computer. The usefulness of the video feature is tempered by the fact that there must be another video phone on the other end.
Unlimited long distance is offered by other companies, and with cell phones it's less critical these days.
First the video phone is capable of replacing traditional land line phones, Skype isn't. It does not support 911 like traditional phones and the video phone does; it does not support caller ID in most countries; it also doesn't provide at least 10 of the features the video phone does.
Being so, the video phone is capable of serving markets Skype can't.
The video phone doesn't replace a land line, it's just another device that utilizes it. For someone who does not use a landline, they'd have to get one for the video phone.
Skype does the same thing your video phone does: it allows people to talk to people with video. Skype utilizes equipment most folks already have, allows access to more people, and is much cheaper.
Skype serves the market just fine, because they don't see video communication as having anything to do with a phone. If somebody needs to call 911, they have a cell phone for that. If they have a landline, they can get a $10 phone to do the same.
What's asinine is that you're trying to cram video capability into a technology which is consistently losing users. It didn't work years ago when landlines were popular, and it won't work now that they have fallen out of favor.
American Communication Network
Given ACN is a private company it would be very difficult to get a hold of their financial statements and even determine how much they purchase the landline services for.
The reason why their market share is not as big as one would believe it should be given their value proposition, is because they dont embark in traditional forms of advertising ie commercial, telemarketing, billboards etc.
Being so, many haven't even heard of ACN, much less the value proposition they offer.
05/09 - It's really just remarkable to watch the incredible about-faces ACN reps pull. If you go to a meeting and act interested, they gush compliments and stroke your ego like nothing else. They say things like: "I can tell you're the kind of person who can appreciate the genius in a system like this."
"I can tell you've got the talent and determination it takes to succeed in this business."
"You've got a warm, open personality that'll make you a ton of money in this organization."
But 3 years later, when you're spinning your wheels and not getting anywhere, and you finally wise up and decide to cut your losses, just look at the kind of vitriol those very same members spew:
"You're a quitter, you've failed at everything else at life and you've failed at this, too. I should've known better than to believe in a loser like you."
To me, it doesn't matter whether they were merely disingenuous and patronizing at the beginning, or downright rude and offensive at the end. Either way, it's not a crowd I'd want to associate myself with.
I think it would be particularly hurtful to be on the receiving end of that kind of verbal abuse when the individual is someone you once considered a friend, or even a family member. After all, isn't the whole network built upon peoples' "warm lists?"
Who needs that kind of stress? And for what? To earn a measly 0.25% per month on a few $30 phone bills? Whoop-de-doo! Someone call Robin Leech!
Of course, the REAL money is in applying these same manipulative tactics to your own friends and family, to convince them to part with their own $500, so you can claw your way up the pyramid a little farther.
And in the end, should you actually perservere and sell your soul and suck enough of your "warm list" into the pyramid with you, your reward is a lifetime stream of passive income, right?
Uh, not exactly. As your "downlines" either get promoted themselves (succeed), or quit (fail), you'll lose your residuals from their streams. In addition, you've got to keep selling yourself, lest you become "unqualified" and lose your status.
That means that in order to keep earning your income, you've got to be constantly pounding the pavement, signing up new customers and recruiting new representatives. Of course, that's pretty hard to do once you've exhausted your "warm list." Strangers, it seems, aren't nearly as inclined to "do you a favor."
The scammy part is that they don't tell you that last bit at the meetings. They show a video with people living the high life off residual income, giving you the impression that once you've achieved a certain level, you can relax and spend your days sipping margaritas on a beach, when in fact that couldn't be further from the truth.
But that's the ONLY carrot worth working for in pyramids like this. So if it turns out that that's not real, then what's the point at all in selling out your relationships with friends and family and ruining all those dinner parties with your opportunistic sales pitches?
Do you really want all your friends and family to cringe at the sight of you, out of fear of being accosted with yet another sales pitch?
If you want to succeed in business, find something you're passionate about (are ANY of you guys actually "passionate" about affordable long distance?), build it into a business following a legitimate, time-proven business model, and work hard at it.
There are no short cuts, even if Donald Trump was paid to tell you there are.
The other thing that blows my mind about how brainwashed these MLM reps are is that if you say you're not interested, they automatically dismiss you as a failure. I make 6 figures doing a job I love, and that affords me evening and weekends with my family, but somehow if I'm not interested in sacrificing that in order to make 0.25% on my parents' phone bill, I'm a "failure."
Excuse me, but I'm not the one wasting my Saturday mornings in some stale hotel conference room, harassing my friends and family. But somehow, I'm the "failure."
Just unbelievable. That's gotta be some incredibly strong Kool-Aid.
ACN MLM Business
05/09 - You just don't get it, do you.
Let's be generous and say maybe 5% of MLM reps ever actually attain the level where they're earning "ridiculous money." The problem I - and many others - have with network marketing is that the other 95% are earning next to nothing!
Worse still, the 5% who are making the "ridiculous money" are taking it directly from the pockets and efforts of the 95% who are getting nothing!
Can you understand that? Can you finally comprehend that THAT is why people with half a brain object to MLMs? They prey on the naive, the trusting, the ignorant, and worst of all, the desperate.
The only thing the greedy elite at the top of the pyramid can offer the poor minions to spur them to keep on going is by telling them that if they stick with it, then someday they may be the ones earning big money off of other peoples' work.
Of course, the deck is stacked enormously against them. If the proletariat show even a hint of discouragement, they're berated as "quitters."
Let's say you walk into a casino in Las Vegas. You go up to a slot machine with a sign that says "Grand Prize: $1,000,000" and it costs $50,000 to play. The odds are 20-to-1 against winning.
You put in $50,000 and pull the lever. Unsurprisingly, you lose. You put in another $50,000 and try again. You lose again. At this point, you're out of money, but your credit card has a $50,000 limit.
You could buy one more pull of the lever by maxing out your credit card, but the odds are still 20-to-1 against winning. You decide to walk away, embarassed for being so stupid, and wondering how you'll explain to your wife that you lost $100,000.
Just then, a casino staff member jumps out and says, "Where are you going? Surely you're not quitting, are you? That machine has fantastic odds, you'd have to be an idiot to quit now. Where else will you find 20-to-1 odds at a million bucks? Nowhere!
Just think what you could do with $1,000,000. I won it myself 3 times last week. You've already invested in 2 pulls, the next pull could be the winner. You'll never earn that much money slaving away in some cubicle for some rich CEO like the rest of the lemmings out there. A real leader knows that to win big, you've gotta take risks. So which are you - a quitter or a winner?"
Now, would you turn around, march back to that machine, swipe your credit card and blow another $50,000? Or would you walk away, having learned an expensive lesson?
By the way, 20-to-1 odds are the same odds as the success rate widely cited for MLMs: 5%.
ACN Top Earners
I know what I'm about to say will come as a shock to many MLM-ers, but success is not synonymous with money. Not everyone equates "success" with "a pile of money."
I consider myself extremely successful, because I have a happy marriage, my health, good friends, a job I enjoy with coworkers I like, and the opportunity to spend quality time with my family on a regular basis.
I know, I know, I'm such a failure.I cry myself to sleep at night. If only I had the "Big Thinking" vision and initiative that all those millionaire MLM-ers have.
Also, you're misusing the idea of "obsessing" towards success. Pro athletes "obsess" about excelling at their sport, and are rewarded with riches. Rock stars "obsess" over their art, and are rewarded with riches.
MLM disciples, on the other hand, "obsess" over nothing more than the riches themselves. Sorry, but it doesn't work that way.
MLMs polarize your relationships. They divide your social circle into two groups: those who believe and those who don't.
Those who believe (even if only temporarily) join the MLM with you, becoming your downline. Where before, you'd talk about sports and family, now your conversations center around the MLM.
You both dress nicer, but there's no longer any such thing as just "hanging out." Now, you're always "networking." You've become a single-minded bore, but so have your downline friends, so you're able to continue to hang out and talk about how rich you're all going to be someday.
Well, 5% of you, anyway. The other 95% will eventually quit without ever making hardly anything at all.
In the other group, you have those who don't believe in MLMs, and who've quickly become bored with having every conversation with you inevitably steered towards your stupid MLM. You just won't shut up about it, so they've chosen to distance themselves from you.
Your fellow MLM zombies tell you that that's fine, because they were just holding you back from realizing your potential anyway.
They'll be sorry someday when they're all laughing and socializing at their crappy family Christmas party, while you're living the high life in some hotel conference room in another city wearing a suit and tie, high-fiving all your MLM buddies. Yeah! Wooo hoo!
We're awesome! We're winners! Well... 5% of us, at least.
ACN Group Think
When my friend told me she was joining ACN, I made it clear I thought all MLMs were scams. I wished her luck, and told her I wasn't interested.
A week later, she called me up and said she needed a "favor." "Sure, of course, what can I do?" I foolishly answered. "I want you to come to this meeting." I had already agreed, so I did it. My wife and I sat through the whole thing, then got out of there as soon as we could.
Since then, I've felt a little resentful toward my friend. She knew how I felt about MLMs, but she took advantage of my friendship and willingness to help her out to try and make some money off of me.
I felt hurt. She used a "line" on me, knowing it would work to manipulate me. Can I really trust her again after that? Now, the next time she asks me for a favor, I'll always have a slight hesitation in the back of my mind, whether I mean to or not.
This is someone I once considered a close friend, and want to trust again. But how can I? ACN took that away from me, and I'll always resent them for damaging that trust and innocence.
ACN Representatives Websites
You have to pay an extra $30 bucks a month for a personalized website and back office.
If you never recruit anyone, you won't even profit your 2 cents off those cell phones. Each contract you sign up is worth $0.40 a month to you.
If you can sign up one a week, you'll make $20 a month for a total of $240 by the end of the year, but you spent $500 to be a member, $360 for your website, $190 for the International Convention, then you're gonna pay $150 to renew?!? that's a net $800+ loss for the year... nice business plan!
How Does ACN Work?
People in general don't understand MLM, so they fear it and are prone to believe what they 'hear'.
I think most people understand it just fine. Have you ever sat down and actually down the math behind an MLM?
If you did, you would understand that the MLM business model is inherently flawed and is doomed to failure from the start.
06/09 - Here is what each rep gets for their $499...
- Over 1000 Customer Service Representatives who handle customer billing, service, maintenance, tech support, and collections
- The Ability to do business in 20 Countries World Wide
- Authorized Dealer status with Verizon, TMobile, AT&T, Sprint, Nextel, Alltel, DirecTV, Dish Network, and ADT Home Security and anyone else ACN chooses to do business with.
- Free online and over-the-phone business support and training
- The Personal Endorsement of the World's most famous (infamous?) billionaire, Donald Trump
- Entrance into a compensation plan that pays upfront bonuses and back end residual income whenever customers are acquired and pay their bill, without limit to the number of customers that can be acquired, without any requirement to personally be a customer yourself.
- Legal Support of four former Attorney's General (One of which made his career on locking up scammers) to ensure the legal and ethical integrity of the company in accordance with the laws.
- Pre-positioning to market any and all future products that ACN may develop, acquire, or form partnerships with at no additional cost.
ACN Marketing Scam?
When you look at their comp structure, it is really weak from levels 1-4. Now they claim it is so because you will have the majority of your customers in levels 5-7, but honestly, i felt it was like this because this is where most people end up...between 1-4.
So they make it weak so they can reap all the benefits. When I did the math, if someone just gets to level 4, following the 2 person rule (you get 2 people, they each get 2 people, etc) and the 20 customer rule they have on their presentation, you would have 30 reps and 600 customers.
So how much do you generate for ACN? $15k in fees, and $18k in monthly billing for their vid phone. What's your take? $240/month. That's nice extra income, but just doesn't seem fair for getting 600 customers and 30 reps.
I couldn't find anything on the CABS and the rep who brought me in didn't understand them either, so I can't really speak to the CAB structure. I was merely looking at residuals. ACN's whole selling point was the residual income.
Let's say, I just wanted to sell and didn't want to recruit. Well, a rep would need to sell $1,999 worth of monthly billings just to get to 2%.
So you would need to sell over 65 plans at $29.99 each just to get to that level. And that only nets you $40 in monthly residuals. To get to 3%, you would need to sell about 133 and net $120/month in vid phone residuals.
133 plans? That's a lot of work imo.
ACN a Scam?
You'll constantly see that big number of $11k per month. But just to get to that point, you'd have to have a everyone get 2 reps and each rep has to get 20 customers. That would net you 256 total reps and over 5k in customers.
So think about this from a mathematical perspective. If it was really this easy, everyone would be doing it right? So let's say, for the sake of argument, it is this easy. ACN recruits and does these big meetings every week.
So let's say they get 10 people each week to join up and each new rep achieves these 7 levels. So these 10 new reps would have over 50k in customers in their organization. Now multiply that times 52 weeks.
How many customers is that? Almost 3 million. How many people live in your city? Even if I lower the expectation to 5 new reps a week, that's still 1.3 million a year, but then how many years have ACN been recruiting? 7? 10?
How is it that you aren't ALREADY a customer? Do you get my point? It's not that easy and not everyone will reach the 7th level. The sheer mathematics dictates that it's not possible for everyone to reach level 7. ACN knows this.
So you have to just take it down a notch and assume most only get to level 3 or 4. And then when you take that into consideration, you look at ACN's comp structure and see if it's fair at that level. That's why they make levels 1-4 so miniscule in terms of residual income. They reap all the benefits of your hard work.
I have no doubt some people got filthy rich from ACN and I'm not saying it's impossible. But I'm just saying it's not as easy as they make it to be. It really depends on what your goal is in joining.
ACN Members Success Rates
Listen to what the ACN reps suggest success rates are, then follow what really happens. I believe you will see that all most people ever do is get alot of near useless equipment, and then waste alot of money going to seminars, rallies, and home office tours.
Then they are so ashamed that they did not succeed at this near impossible to fail at scam, that once they do fail, you never hear from them again on this matter.
It's all really shameful, humiliating, and demeaning, all in the name of making money. And the longer someone stays in the scam, the more shameful and demeaning they feel.
I've been travelling all over my state for 8 months and have probably made 20K to date. Ive made my TC over 50K in the same amount of time.
Breakage basically means when someone comes into your business and becomes the same rank as you, you no longer get credit for anything they do UNTIL you make the next rank up.
If you get cutoff, you're doing the right thing! Just develop those other legs to ETL, and you should be close if not TC. If you have 100 customers in your 7th, you would be making about 2-400 a month in residuals just on that level.
Then, you would have levels 5 and 6 which would probably be quite a bit too. I'd go get those points knocked out. You're losing money!
An example of breakage would be for a TC who brings in 99 reps qualified with customers. He/She would make 16950 that month. However, if they just referred in one more business partner, they would have made 30,000
RVPs still need 40 personal CPs in order to qualify for the lower level residual payout, just like any other rep. ACN is smart with this, they'd be paying out the ass if all of their RVPs were grandfathered the residuals.
They bank on the fact that most will never get this (which they don't). However, as you said, RVPs are indeed grandfathered in to qualify for the TCAB bonuses.
RVP Residual Income
You don't need 40 points to get paid RVP residual income. It's automatic infinity at RVP.
Its automatic infinity until someone below you becomes an RVP. What happens then?
Generational inifinity. I have multiple RVP's in my team and still get paid on every single last customer within my group.
Either way, the residual payment is automatic for RVP's.
ACN National Convention
Can anybody tell me how much it costs to go to an ACN national convention such as the one coming up in North Carolina? I'm not talking about travel expenses --- just enrollment in the convention itself.
$99 for the overflow event..but there are hundreds of seats now available in the main event place, but ACN will not refund people's tickets if they choose not to go.
ACN Sales Techniques
There is only one way to be successful in ACN: recruit, recruit, recruit. I would have my team recruit in every way possible. We put out ads, solicited people at job fairs, and even would go to local college campuses and just start going up to people and talking to them.
My typical day would start at 7 am with a few hours of recruiting, followed by business presentations for the rest of the day.
I would return calls in the afternoon for a few hours, and then in the evening I would usually have to go to some event or presentation for a larger group. When I wasn't working, my phone would be constantly ringing.
The turnover was pretty disheartening too....I would spend a month with a person teaching them everything, and most of the time they would end up quitting. I couldn't blame them either; it was so hard for people to get customers.
People in the business act like getting customers is so easy. It's not easy...the products are usually either at market price or even a little more expensive, plus on top of that customer service was absolutely horrible.
Can you make money with ACN? Sure you can. But honestly, if you can't picture yourself constantly going up to strangers and trying to sell them on this "opportunity", then don't even try it.
You need to be thinking recruit 24 hours a day, 7 days a week in order to make any real money.
You need to be willing to recruit every single person who you come in contact with. If you can't picture yourself going up to a complete stranger and talking with him or her about ACN, then forget it, you're not going to make it.
They try to tell you that it's easy as long as you follow the plan, and that anyone can do it. Baloney. Very few people can make it in this business. You have to be a damn good salesman, and it takes years of experience to get good enough to make significant money.
However, if you're a shark and you can sell, you'll do great. But don't think that you're going to retire in 3-5 years or whatever crap they tell you. It's not going to happen. You will recruit for the rest of your time in this business.
There are three opinions about every subject: 1. An opinion of failure. 2. An opinion of speculation. 3. An opinion of success.
If you want to fail, to whom should you listen?
If you want theory, to whom should you listen?
If you want success, to whom should you listen?
Do you go seek the coaching of the drunk ex-golfer about your golf swing or Tiger Woods?
ACN Failure Rate
If ACN is so lucrative, then why don't they reveal the success and failure rate of everyone involved in the business?
Why is everything so hidden from day 1? When you go to a business meeting, the first thing you hear about is wealth and money. What else in life works like this?
You say 20% of people are successful in any business, but in ACN the more realistic number is closer to 1% (Most seasoned reps will admit this). I personally would love to see an independent audit/study on ACN and the breakdown of income earners.
When I told people in my upline in ACN that I was going to graduate school, instead of congratulating me and wishing me well (like most normal people do), they tried to talk me out of it and tell me that I was a fool.
They said that I would make more money with ACN and that it wasn't worth it. They gave me the typical propoganda that they used to brainwash other people.
Stuff like this:
"Why do you want to be a slave to your job??"
"You're gonna go back to the rat race, huh?"
"JOB= Just Over Broke"
"Honestly, I knew you weren't cut out for this...enjoy being a loser for the rest of your life."
"Have fun working while I'm retired!"
All of these people were people that I spent a long number of hours with and that I considered very good friends. Within a month, very few of us spoke anymore. I wasn't surprised.
Many leaders in ACN will tell you not to hang out with people who aren't in the business, because they will try to "crush your dream." In my opinion, people in ACN are the ones who are dream stealers and closed minded.
I cannot think of any other company or situation in life that would actually look down on you for pursuing higher education. People in ACN have one objective: to make money. Anything else to them is a waste of time and effort.
Reality of ACN and MLM Success
Some people just don't have the skill, talent set, or the desire to be successful in an MLM. The propoganda that anyone can do it is nonsense. It takes a certain type of person with a certain set of skills.
The idea that anyone can be successful in ACN if they "try hard enough" is like saying anyone can be a astrophysicist or a professional athlete if they "try hard enough." Unfortunately, this is just not true.
Different people have different talents...they should use their talents to their strengths. If business and sales aren't a strength, then what's wrong with that? I guess artists and musicians are losers because they don't want to sell communication products.
Doctors and lawyers must be morons, because they obviously don't provide a service as important as selling video phones. The problem with people like you is that you are too myopic to understand this concept.
Totally Sold on ACN
You are so right my friend, there is way more to life than money.
There are dreams: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5h9yRhRZHf8
There are friends and family: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a-6-vI9CoFM&feature=channel_page
I am having the time of my life. I am exceptionally happy to hear you too are having the time of your life. ENJOY!! All the best to you.
ACN Rock Star
One 4-Star RVPs 2008 total income broke down to being 87% bonuses and 13% residuals (with wireless bounties spreadout).
Without the wireless bounties spread out to look like residuals, the split is 89% bonus and 11% residual. This is after building the business for 6 years day in & day out and achieveing 4-Star RVP.
Out of 28 active TC's under myself and 3 other RVP's, I have 24 fully qualified to receive their full residual. Of the 4 not qualified, 1 is hitting RVP so fast we are not worrying about it, 1 TC just hit it and will have their 40 in a week or so and 2 are just wasting their money for an unknown reason (I cannot save everyone).
I also have many TT's whom earn anywhere from a couple of hundred dollars a month to a high of $7k per month in pure residual income by keeping 40 pts. 40 pts is simple when an average home has 10+ pts in it.
BTW, I have several TT's earning more residual income than this mythical RVP for which we can get no documentation. I, as always, am more than happy to provide complete documentation and you'll find in another thread confirmation of proof to another board member who challenged the facts and posted the results. Documentation ALWAYS beats conversation.
Success as an ACN rep is not guaranteed, but rather influenced by an individual's specific efforts. Not all IR's make a profit and no one can be guaranteed success as an ACN IR.
Top Level ACN Rep Residuals
There are two different ways that an RVP will earn residual income. The first is levels 1-7. To earn full residual on all levels 1-7, they must have 40 points.
To earn residual from 8-infinity, they must have 3 legs with TC's in each leg, 4 if they are 4star.
You can make thousands on customers 8-infinity if you are not an RVP. You're simplying going to make your openline t-cabs from those customers. Residual only begins at levels 8 for RVP or higher.
I'm confused about what you stated about RVP's earning residuals -- First you say that RVP's earn residual on levels 1-7 if they have 40 points. Then you say that residual only begins at levels 8 for RVP or higher.
Also, RVPMatt says that RVP's don't need 40 points to earn residuals. This is all very confusing -- What is the truth about RVP's and residuals?
ACN Scam Company?
The problem I have is the fact that you really have to spend about 750 dollars to start your business..500 entry, 200 Video phone, 30 business assistant.
How many people in today's economy have an extra 750 lying around? Its a numbers game..sure, there are people that can do it, but can the masses?
Another thing, getting cut off SUCKS in this business. You work and work to become an ETL, then when someone attains ETL, it cuts you off from that leg..if you dont have anyone on fire in the other 2 or 3 legs, you can literally make ZERO the next month..lets see, work for months, make 3K plus one month, then none the next month? T me, that just isnt right.
Lastly, I dont care what anyone says, getting 40 points is not easy at all. I have a group of over 160 people, and mayybe 6 or 7 have 15 points or higher. Why is that?
ACN is smart..they cap the pay at 3 levels until you get 20 points..they are playing the odds that about 90% of people arent going to get 20 points, thus those commissions stay in the company.
lots of postings
More detailed info can be found at ACN MLM networking business.
ACN Australian Communication Network versus Peter Bowditch.
ACN Scam.com discussions 2005
ACN Scam.com discussions 2006
ACN Scam.com discussions 2007-a
ACN Scam.com discussions 2007-b
ACN Scam.com discussions 2008
ACN Scam.com discussions 2008-b
ACN Scam.com discussions 2009
ACN Scam.com discussions 2009-c